[00:00:00] Ellington Brown: Welcome to SpeakUP! International with Rita Burke and Elton Brown! Today our guest, Jebeh Edmunds, will read an excerpt from her bestseller, The Orange Blossom, The Orange Blossom. Jebeh Edmunds, the virtual floor is yours! 

[00:00:33] Jebeh Edmunds: Thank you! Nearly a year had passed since the rice riots had left 41 protestors dead, and hundreds wounded.

A brutal voice of unrest that has shattered the veil of peace. The founding settlers dream that had once shown brightly in the hearts of freed black colonists who had landed on the shores of Africa's first republic was on the brink of ruin. The country's pulse had beaten to the sound of the African drum.

Its erratic rhythms and speed were not syncopated. The dancers could not find the right direction and had become panicked. The uneasy tension between the descendants of the indigenous peoples and the descendants of the freed settlers was about to trip. Into a clash that would lead into generational suffering.

Through the bitterness, resentment, and foreign powers looming over the administration, like Hungry Vultures, Europe and the United States had kept a watchful eye with suspicion and desperation to keep Liberia under their influence. At the same time, communist regimes and whispered promises to the current president's ears.

Tension was building, waiting, watching, wondering which way the lone star would fall.

[00:01:46] Rita Burke: More, more, more!

That is absolutely beautiful. Oh, I'm, 

[00:01:52] Jebeh Edmunds: thank you. 

[00:01:53] Rita Burke: Like a child. I'm like a child. I like to be read to and I'll say something before I officially introduce you, Ms. That, um, one of the words. You used as you were reading syncopated. I have not heard that word since I was a child, so it really tickled something in my soul.

So thank you. Now thank you. As, as you know on SpeakUP! International, we have conversations with people we consider to be community buildings, and today is no exception. We are speaking with the person who you heard reading at the top of the show. Her name is Jebeh Edmunds. She's an educator. She's an author, and she's a cultural competency expert.

Jbe hosts a podcast where she helps educators and leaders create spaces where every voice is value. Permission is to equip educators, leaders, and change makers with the tools and confidence. Build truly inclusive classrooms, workplaces, and communities. And today it's with great joy that I introduce our listeners to Jebeh Edmunds!.

Welcome to SpeakUP! International! 

[00:03:21] Jebeh Edmunds: Thank you both for having me, Rita and Elton. Pleasure is all mine. 

[00:03:26] Ellington Brown: Oh, the pleasure is ours. Truly ours! You have worked with over 70 organizations what common DEI challenges have you, encountered and how do you address those challenges? 

[00:03:48] Jebeh Edmunds: Yes. The commonality was people are overwhelmed.

They don't know where to start, how to keep going. Um, in times of, um. You know, societal. You know, tensions and afraid, the fear of saying or doing the wrong thing. And so my biggest thing when I would go into these organizations was to help develop a plan that we could put all of our list, I would say like our list of initiatives on a piece of paper or on a document, and we would circle the top three priorities and start with those three and start checking and connecting and that to me, helped my organizations see in front of them tangible ways that they didn't have to, you know, check off everything on their big list of initiatives. But to start with three, it just seemed more, um, palatable. For them to say, okay, these are our top three initiatives going through this cycle of this project.

We still know we have things to do, but at least we can start with these three. And I think that really helped them get that foot in front of the other to start moving and to start changing. Because what they saw in the beginning was their list, but they didn't start and nothing continued. So just giving them that nudge of just start with three and then we will build on as we go from there.

[00:05:17] Rita Burke: So, yeah, sometimes this can be intimidating, can't they? 

[00:05:21] Jebeh Edmunds: Mm-hmm. 

[00:05:21] Rita Burke: Yes. So I hear you. What you did obviously set your priorities as to the three most important to begin with. Now, you are a cultural competency expert. That was quite a mouthful for me to get around. And even though I know each word and what they mean, explain what you do in that role, please.

Yes. Cultural competency is learning from people where they are and to know that as well as we are all individuals, we all carry different cultures. It could be racial, ethnic, it could be a culture of being a veteran. It could be a culture of having a disability, um, uh, learning ability that could be different.

It could be a culture of people who love to quilt or play, uh, board games. It's a way of life. And so to be culturally competent is to understand that people have different identities and cultures different than your own. And to be, um, cognizant about it and to be responsive in a positive way, that we are not just one homogenous group.

We all carry different identities. So when people come to me and ask me for their advice. Or working with their school system. We come in with that notion that people have different perspectives and, um, and that what, that's what makes us all innovators in, in our own right of the, the qualities that we all bring to the table.

[00:06:58] Ellington Brown: Wow! Well said. By the way, 

[00:07:01] Jebeh Edmunds: thank you, 

[00:07:01] Ellington Brown: if I may say so myself. What inspired you to launch the Cultural Curriculum Chat podcast? 

[00:07:13] Jebeh Edmunds: Yes. Yeah. Yes, 

[00:07:13] Ellington Brown: and am Ms. Edmond's Cultural Corner. On YouTube, is that two channels? 

[00:07:20] Jebeh Edmunds: Mm-hmm. 

Two channels. I'm busy. 

[00:07:22] Ellington Brown: I know. Talk to us about that. Tell us what, what those two channels are about.

Yeah. Yes. Well, when I was a classroom teacher, um, I taught for 18 years in Northern Minnesota and I loved sharing different cultures, um, to my students. And I decided that within my four walls, I need to send it globally. So that's what was the birth of, um. The cultural curriculum chat and Mrs. Edmond's Cultural Corner.

I started out by doing book reviews, um, written by Bipoc authors, um, giving teachers around the world strategies of how I would use the book in my classroom, and, um, also interviewing. These bipoc authors and change makers, um, so people would recognize them as well as the author behind the books and the, um, change maker, community organizer right here to learn more about their platform.

And so. It's been going on. This is going to be our fifth year this, uh, November next month. And, um, it's just been a wonderful time of interviewing New York time bestselling authors and illustrators on the show, um, as well as experts in cultural responsive learning and education. That a lot of us in this country don't really know or follow, so they come to me for that platform to share their voice with the rest of the world.

[00:08:53] Rita Burke: Sounds as if it is exciting. It's educating, it's inspiring. 

[00:08:59] Jebeh Edmunds: Yes. 

[00:08:59] Rita Burke: Now you work with other organizations. Expand on that collaboration for us, please. 

[00:09:07] Jebeh Edmunds: Mm-hmm. Yes. Let's say for example, there's a nonprofit, um, dance ballet group that's trying to be more culturally responsive, um, with their dancers and with their, um, board of directors.

And what I have done in the past is doing, um, several, um, cultural responsive trainings with them looking at, um, their dance, um, season. What characters are going to be on the stage? Could we have people of different identities representing that same character that we've known for all those years? For example, like a Swan Lake, you know, performance, um, and, and really letting.

And guiding those, um, folks in that organization of how to see things differently, how to audit their own work, what is missing, who is missing, who are the groups of people that we have not reached out to in the community that could be influenced by the dance education program. So just having those courageous conversations of how they could think differently to expand their reach with the board of directors, letting them also have a buy-in and understanding of what the organization that they are representing is working on to be more inclusive. Um, and that to me, if you have all people at the table, that's when you make the most progress.

When you don't have everybody there, there comes to be lack of transparency, lack of trust, and um, so that's just one, you know, explanation. With my nonprofits that I work with, with my for-profits, we kind of tweak it a little bit to the clientele that there's serving and as well as their workforce. How can we retain, we're so big on recruiting, recruiting diverse workforces, but we don't have a psychologically safe environment for them to retain. And so that is something that a lot of companies, especially for profit, they put a lot of money in the recruitment, but then they see that their diverse workforce leaves less than five years into that program. And so what strategies can I help them along the way to retain.

Pain that, um, different uh, workforce group of people. 

[00:11:37] Rita Burke: Jebeh, let me cheat a little bit. It's Elton's turn Sure. But I wanna, I want to get you to talk a little bit about something you just mentioned. You talked about the psychologically safe environment. What does that look like? What does it sound like? What does it feel like?

[00:11:52] Jebeh Edmunds: Yes. When you are in a psychologically safe environment, you feel that you can be your whole self. You don't feel like you have to explain ad nauseum, how you do your hair. You don't have to explain ad nauseum. The food you have in the break room, people are just going to let you just be who you are. Um, there's nothing to feel like you're being interrogated by coming up with new initiatives or enhancing a project when you're working with a group of people. Um, that's exactly when it means to be psychologically safe. I can go into my workforce. I feel like people listen to me. I feel like I belong. I also feel like my voice is heard when harm has been done. When those things are not at the table, I keep saying table.

I don't know why I haven't had my coffee yet, but when things are not there, you're going to see that lack of. Um. Safety within that person and that individual. They don't feel like they can give their all to a project. They don't feel like they should even talk to a superior if they have had harm because they feel like that superior will not be consistent in following through with the the disciplinary actions.

And so that's when it means when you feel psychologically safe, you feel like you can do your work to the best that you can with the support that you have and also the space that you can just be. 

A lot of people see that support, but they don't also recognize that I also need space. I also need time to just be myself, to heat up my fufu and soup in the, you know, in the workroom.

You know, without somebody looking at me and my soup and going, Ooh, what's that? What are you eating? You know? That's the type of thing that when I talk about psychological safety is what's important. 

[00:13:48] Ellington Brown: And I would agree, I think that is extremely, important, is to have that psychological part anchored. It's really, really, important.

And to go right to my next topic, what advice do you give to leaders and educators when you know, you're, you're seeing.

Where there's harm being done. 

[00:14:18] Jebeh Edmunds: Mm-hmm. 

[00:14:18] Ellington Brown: It may be unintentional, it's just happened. So how do you move a company from, away from the guardrails Yeah. And get them on smoother roads? 

[00:14:33] Jebeh Edmunds: Yeah, yeah, it's, that's a really good question, Elton. I think the biggest thing for organizations to do when harm has been done is to acknowledge that harm has been done and to work on repairing that harm.

A lot of times people want to sweep it under the rug and go, oh, are you sure? And they minimize. The hurt that has been there, they minimize or even diminish that, oh, you know, that person, they didn't mean it. Or you know, that person's gonna retire in a couple years. I dealt with them before. It's not that serious.

And that's when the harm even gets a more bigger wound because now you're not listening to the person. Who trusted you enough to report it. Um, so the biggest thing is to address it head on. Um, and of course go with the protocols that are in place, um, within your organization, but at least to address it and to start the repair process.

A lot of, um, employees and and colleagues. This is the time, the tipping point where a lot of diverse. Um, colleagues start leaving because they don't see the follow through and they feel like their voice has been diminished and silenced. And so the biggest piece is to address when things have come up.

You might not have the tools to guide you through that, but to address it and then. Find those resources, find those consultants, find those experts in culturally responsive training in your human resources department to help you go along with the protocols, but to quickly diminish or minimize, that's when you see a lot of people that just leave their jobs quit or work remotely at home full time because their safest at home versus being in the work floors.

[00:16:33] Rita Burke: Yeah. Because people are not getting it. Yes. People are just not getting it. 

[00:16:38] Jebeh Edmunds: They're not getting it 

[00:16:38] Rita Burke: And it's so much easier to minimize. Yes. And to diminish people's concerns than to deal with it head all. Yes. I like, I like that. Now on SpeakUP! International, we speak, we seek to inspire, to educate, to inform.

You have a podcast as well. What, what goals are you attempting, attempting to accomplish with the content of your podcast? 

[00:17:06] Jebeh Edmunds: Yes. My goal is to educate families, educators, community members, to know you can get a little good grasp of a new strategy to help with a neighbor next door. You could help with a new strategy.

For your child to read a book that doesn't represent them, but helps open up the dialogue at home. That was my biggest thing for my podcast, was to have just enough information that you can make these micro changes in your day-to-day life. So many people say, oh, I wanna be more inclusive. I don't know where to start.

Put in a lesson. I have a lesson plan right on there to talk about, um, you know, how to see a child that is, um, deaf, what. What can you do to help that child that you know in your community that is deaf to accommodate them when they hang out and, and, and play with your child? There's tons of examples of how you could be more culturally aware of foods that we eat, culturally aware that not everybody celebrates Halloween and Thanksgiving.

And, and when you do talk about those traditions, how can you open. And questions that those other families that don't celebrate the same holidays that they could share about themselves in a pro, you know, in a positive way. So that's been my biggest push for this podcast, that it's short and sweet. You get to hear, um, my sense of humor with some of my stories.

Being an immigrant in the United States, you also get to hear from these experts that have walked the walk that are here to help you keep moving forward.

[00:18:56] Ellington Brown: How do you define success? When it comes to cultural compete, competency and inclusion, you talked a little bit about those. 

[00:19:07] Jebeh Edmunds: Yeah. 

[00:19:07] Ellington Brown: Two things. I, I just wanna slide it over just a little bit. 

[00:19:11] Jebeh Edmunds: Sure. 

[00:19:12] Ellington Brown: Because you've talked about dealing with individuals and getting them to a point where they are, I'm gonna use the word aware. Yes. So how do you define success? 

[00:19:24] Jebeh Edmunds: Oh, that's good. How do I define success is when? An organization can take a breath and go, wow, we had a point where we had maybe a little bit of contention or something made us think twice of our actions in the past and we corrected it. That is what I define as success.

When they can check and correct their own implicit bias, when they can say, oh my goodness, I am so sorry I said that, or my actions were like this. I will do my best to do better. It is not your job, Jebeh to do better. It is my job. That's what I define as success. When a organization or an individual come to me and say, you know what?

This is what happened and this is how I corrected it, so that way. It might not have been a solution in the background before, but now I have the tools to repair that harm moving forward. To me, that is a huge success in my work. Yeah, 

[00:20:26] Rita Burke: and it is so important for us to have the tools because those are not tools that our parents teach us when we are growing up and we're living in such a complex world, these days.

Such a diverse world that we do need those things. Sounds good to me. Sounds good to me. Now, talk to us a little bit about who or what is responsible for the person you are today? 

[00:20:55] Jebeh Edmunds: My mom and my dad. Yeah. They raised me to be unapologetically Liberian American. They raised me to be an educated woman who is raising her family with pride.

And God too who's got me here breathing every single day and walking along with me. So yes, my parents have really instilled in me to share our stories of our people back home, to walk with pride of who I am. And with my name, Jebeh, it means love. I was. You know, a member of the VI ethnic group and my, um, great aunt was my namesake chief Jebeh.

And, um, she's gone now too, but just instilling that. That love of, of pride of who I am and, and to share it with, with so much joy. You know, I'm representing my parents and my siblings and the people that I have in my life. And, and, and it's a big, it's big charge, Rita. It really is. But I feel blessed to know that I'm capable of carrying that and sharing who we are unapologetically with the rest of the world. 

[00:22:19] Ellington Brown: Well, you are definitely carrying a lot. I don't know how you're juggling all of these things that you're doing, but, okay. And now maybe we should get a recording of that. What keeps you motivated in this work? Especially when conversations around inclusion can be difficult, and sometimes it even raises emotions.

[00:22:45] Jebeh Edmunds: Casey moti motivated are my children because they're this next generation and I want them to not have a question in their mind of saying, well, what did mom do? What did Dad do to keep us going forward? You know, on the right side of history? I think that is their big, my biggest motivation is to say, I'm interviewing these companies because my children are going to be in that workforce, and I need those companies to have the tools that they need.

So when my son is working in their organization that they are the best equipped that they can to. See my son and value my son to the best of his ability. I think that's my biggest motivation. And also as a former child, as a former classroom teacher, those last 18 years, I saw those kids at their desks every day, and my motivation is them as well.

You know, they are going out into the workforce, they are going out into the community. They have been, and how can I get as many people in their orbit. Well equipped to know if a girl that looks like me has box braids in one day, and the next day she's got her short cropped hair, their boss isn't gonna question her hairstyle.

So I do still have a lot of work to do Elton and Rita, but I know that the young people have been, my motivation since I started this company is they are the future workforce and I need to get their workforce ready for them because they are so bright, so willing to learn, but we also need to make sure that we're ready and equipped to learn for them as well.

[00:24:25] Rita Burke: Of course the boss needs to note to the people's hairstyle is none of their business. 

[00:24:29] Jebeh Edmunds: That part. That part, Rita? Yes. Mm-hmm. 

[00:24:33] Rita Burke: Need to understand that clearly none of your business. 

[00:24:37] Jebeh Edmunds: Yes. Yes. 

[00:24:38] Rita Burke: And so you talked about your parents and the influence they had on your life and on your decisions and on who you are today.

What would you say is the best piece of advice that you've ever been given? 

[00:24:53] Jebeh Edmunds: Best piece of advice. I honestly feel like the best piece of advice that I've ever been given is the only thing you have to fear is if you're doing something wrong. And I got that from my mother and I, I, I really sit with that because when you want to do something courageous in this world, when you want to make those connections, just go for it.

You know, if you're doing something wrong, that's when your spirit is like, no. Mm-hmm. This isn't right. This is not who you are. Your conscience starts to light up and say, Hmm, put that up. You know, that's not okay. But I haven't had that feeling, so I know I'm doing something right and that's my best advice is to say, the only thing you have to fear is if you're doing something wrong.

You know when people say, oh, I'm afraid I'm gonna say the wrong thing. Well, you probably are gonna say the wrong thing, and that's okay. I. But if you're gonna say something that you know is gonna harm me, your conscience is gonna go up and go. Mm-hmm. I wouldn't say that to her, you know? So just to say and have that open heart of saying, I would love to learn more from you.

In a heart open space, not the educate me, because to me, when someone says educate me, it's very aggressive. And if I always say to them, if you say educate me, you don't wanna learn this education. So you have to come in with an open heart and, and, and also understand. It is not my job to educate you. I always say, Google is free.

If you wanna learn from me, I'll send you my invoice. But you know, that's that. That's the biggest thing. Rita. I dunno if I answered it well, but yeah. The only thing you have to fear is if you're doing something wrong. Yeah. 

[00:26:46] Ellington Brown: Can you tell us about your journey as an educator and what inspired you to focus in on cultural competency?

[00:26:55] Jebeh Edmunds: Yeah. Wow. My journey as an educator wasn't a straight path. Um, I started out as a television news producer right after undergrad, and, um, I wanna say, gosh, four years in, I got another opportunity to work with the African-American Cultural Center in our school district. And I was, um, charged with, um, creating. African heritage, African American cultural, studied lessons for kindergarten through 12th grade. Um, and being Liberian and hearing the, the stuff that my relatives had taught me, um, you know, dances, the songs, the games. Um, the food, I was able to infuse that into, um, those lessons with those students. Then I went back into, um, graduate school and got my master's of teaching.

And when I had my first class of first grade students, I really wanted to infuse my cultural lessons as well as their. Standards and and benchmarks. So I was able to marry both of them and it really piqued parents' interest of, wow, my students are learning how to read, but they're also learning about Nelson Mandela and, oh, we're learning about Indigenous People's Day and wow, this teacher is getting all of our students, you know, open to all of these new things and possibilities.

And my other colleagues are also. Learning that you can have your big tub for Martin Luther King Day, but do you have a tub for Charles Drew? Do you have a tub for maid jemison? And, and that's those type of things where I wanted other educators to know. You don't have to be so rote in infusing cultural studies, and there's so many.

Stereotypical things about Africans, and I wanted to break those stereotypes for students and their families to know there's people like me that live across the ocean that are going to school just like you and are happy and thriving. And so that was something that really I wanted to instill in my students and their families and my colleagues as well.

Yeah. 

[00:29:22] Rita Burke: Sounds to me as if you are, you were a masterful educator by intention, and that yes, by intention really appeals to me. And you've alluded to a lot of things, or you've said a lot of things as we're having this conversation on SpeakUP! International, but I, I want you to tell us. What do you do intentionally to bring joy to your life?

[00:29:54] Jebeh Edmunds: Dance. I love to dance. Yes. Good African music. I am dancing in my kitchen, in the living room, anywhere I go. I love dancing. That's what brings me joy. So much joy and talking to my sisters on the phone and my mother. Um, you know, all of those things just. And being with my family, that just gives me joy. So much joy, especially with working in a field where you have a lot of people very defensive, they don't wanna change their behavior, and who is she to come and tell me that I need to tweak and check and correct my own implicit bias. I, I, I do my work and then I, I space out a couple days in between engagements just to have that, you know, mental break and, and just get me back to my grounding and my intention. 'cause it's lot of hard work, a lot of, um, head work, um, to, to. Go into those spaces, that's a lot of vulnerability.

And so giving me the chance to, to write, um, to dance and to create something artful is really, really important for me to keep going. It recharges my battery. 

[00:31:14] Ellington Brown: Everybody needs their batteries recharged every now and again. 

[00:31:18] Jebeh Edmunds: Oh, yes. I love it. Yes. 

[00:31:21] Ellington Brown: How does your heritage, shape your perspective on inclusion and storytelling.

[00:31:30] Jebeh Edmunds: Yes. Uh, we've always been includers, you know, just growing up, living with extended family members, they always say, come, come, let's go walk about, let's go shopping. Let's do this, let's do that. You're never alone. You're never bored. You know, I had cousins that would spend the whole summer with us growing up, and we had such a very tight bond because of that.

And so, you know, learning from, you know. Majority culture, American society. Some families just don't speak and they live down the street from each other. Some families just, you know, see each other at holidays and they don't connect with each other. Um, and that to me, with my heritage, we were constantly connecting, constantly checking in.

You know, I will never forget I had, um, I was in college and, you know, some unpaid parking tickets thinking, oh, you know, I'm fine. I'll just. Not pay the $10 or whatever and talk about inclusive. My mom was like calling all the relatives to come, you know, chime me on the phone. You better pay that unpaid parking ticket because you're, it's in your, that car's in your mom's name and she doesn't wanna get in trouble.

So talk about inclusion, right? Like they will inclusively discipline you. They will inclusively cheer you on. Um, and that to me was the best childhood and child rearing growing up there was always joy. Even for my head start graduation, I had aunties there celebrating me and my education and uncles cheering me on.

And, and, and to see my sons going through that and seeing them lighting up every time we get together, it's, it was such a blessing to be a part of that. Yeah. Yeah. So yeah, inclusion is just in the fiber of my being. Yeah!

[00:33:20] Ellington Brown: So what are some of the most memorable or impactful conversations that you've had on your podcast? Give us an example where there was one where, you know, after it was over your, you know, your, your brain just went. 

[00:33:37] Jebeh Edmunds: Yes. Oh my goodness. Oh, this woman, Kathleen Kirkwood. Oh, she was amazing. She was one of the architects that created Martin Luther King Jr Day, the federal holiday.

She was one of those peace activists, and she was my first author, guest on my show, she found me. She sent me an advanced copy of her book, ain't Gonna Let Nobody Turn Me Around, and it was her memoir and it was for middle school students and how she actively protested to get Martin Luther King Jr. Day as a federal holiday.

And her, she was so inspiring and she was. So kind and yeah, that was one of those interviews. I will never forget it. Just to meet someone that was on the precipice of history to say yes, we, I was one of those people that made sure that was going to be a federal holiday and that to me was boom highlight of my, my podcasting career.

Yeah. Bar none. Hands down. Yeah. 

[00:34:46] Rita Burke: Podcasts are wonderful because you learn so much. I find that our guests feed us, the educators, they inspire us. And so it's not just us giving, but we receive as well from the podcast. Yes. But I want you to talk about a time in your life when you had to say enough. Could you think of a time either personally or professionally when you had to say that 

[00:35:17] Jebeh Edmunds: Enough. Yeah. Well, I was at a, let's say professionally, I was wrapping up a, um, series of trainings with a particular nonprofit client, and there was a person, staff member. That was like, I was showing them, um, how do you say, um, there were these, I don't wanna, how do you say it? Hang on a second. Um, these, um, inclusive language, um, kind of like their own DEI statements.

Okay. For their website. And so we've been working with this group for like six months and we're kinda working on the finalization of why it's important to have an inclusive statement on your website and in your literature. And one staff member, it was the day after Trump got reelected and he. This staff member, it was a Zoom call and it was like, we don't need to do this.

What's the point? We're not this big Fortune 500 company that you're showing as a, you know, example and you know, and like putting his hands on. You could just see his body language, like, what's the point of doing all of this? I don't wanna do this anymore. And we've got an excuse now. We don't have to. And I, I was very composed, but my feet were just shaking under the table like, oh my goodness, what am I'm gonna do?

And I said, you may be a small nonprofit, but just by the naked eye, you don't know the identities. Various people carry. You might think, oh, we're a homogenous group and what's the point of having an inclusive statement on our website? But you don't know the identities that all of these people that you are taking care of carry and their families that are attached to that.

And it's up to you. Yes, you're not a Fortune 500 company, but this is an example of them speaking out against bias. And you know, the, the coordinator of the event was so thankful that I stood up, but when I said to myself enough was it really hurt me that the six months of going with this company, they still didn't have the tools.

They had the tools. They didn't use the tools that I had given them these last six months to say, stop it! This is the training that we are, we have been doing, and I was really disappointed that his superior that was on that call didn't correct him right then and there, you know, she was waiting for me to do that work, and to me it just kind of was like, okay, enough, I'm done.

So I took a hiatus. A little sabbatical, um, from that work and started writing my book. I needed that creative outlet. Um, and, and it even gave me the, the tools to pivot, you know, to say, Jebeh, you don't have to be in every space you know, physically or through Zoom, they can take your trainings on their own.

And so I recreated all of my training programs to be asynchronous training that they can see a video of me walking them through the steps they have all of my resources at, you know, once they purchase the program packages, they have the certificates. I don't have to be there mentally absorbing that kind of vitriol, and that to me was something where I said, enough, I'm gonna pivot and still give them all of the resources that they need, but I don't have to physically be in that space.

And then they can go after the program and meet me. As another ex, you know, another fee on top of to walk through that, that facilitation after they've done the training versus in real time. So I hope that answered your question, Rita, that I just had to take care of myself mentally, because the vitriol, you could just feel it just rising and bubbling and the emboldened ness of, well, we don't have to listen to what you have to say.

And, and yeah, that's when I said. Okay. Enough that is me to turn and still give my value, but also protect myself.

[00:39:44] Ellington Brown: Well, I definitely think it's very important that you protect yourself because if you don't, you could be damaged, and then how are you going to help anyone if things are not right with you mentally? Yes. That would be a a, a horrible, horrible thing. So you, you talk about education, right?

Mm. And you are, you are an educator. And so, all right, you, so you make this plan up, you got a plan, you know, this is what we're going to talk about, this is what we're going to be doing. Uh, how do you make that accessible for diverse audiences because our audiences well are different. 

[00:40:32] Jebeh Edmunds: Yeah. How do I handle the portion of the training? I have it in such a broad brush of, um, scenarios. I created little scenarios of bias, moments of people, of all walks of life, and I have that open discussion. You know, they can turn with a partner at a training and discuss how would you handle it, how. Do you think that person felt, you know, and what strategies would you use to check and correct that person?

Our biggest thing is to say, you know, call out the statement, not the person. You know, that statement doesn't belong here. Um, you know that state. Statement made me feel uncomfortable. You know, those are the types of tools because it, you're right, there's so many different identities. That's also overwhelming for people to say, do we pinpoint one particular group of people?

No. You can use the same strategy, um, throughout, you know. Here's some scenarios to help you practice. So I have a lot of scenario practicing cards that people can utilize. I have a lot of journal prompts that people can individually kinda write and think and sit with. So yeah, as an educator you can scaffold and accommodate different things that also shed a light on different groups of people as well, and still have that same objective that you want to touch on.

[00:42:00] Rita Burke: What made you go into education in the first place? 

[00:42:05] Jebeh Edmunds: You know, my mom was a awesome first grade teacher, and so, you know, she taught at a different school district in Minneapolis than us in the suburbs. So when we would have breaks, I would go there and watch her teach. And she was a lot different than our mom.

You know, like she was fun, she was dancing, you know, and all the things. She was energetic and, and so for me. I had the bug, you know, and, and I just would play school as a kid growing up, you know, I'm the oldest of four daughters, so I would always tell my sisters what to do, you know? And so for me, teaching was natural.

Um, and when I went back to get my master's, my mom's like, I knew it. I knew you'd be a teacher. And the fun thing is we're all teachers in our, all four of us are teachers in our own capacity. You know, I have a professor. A sister that owns her own dance studio, another sister who is the clinical director of an autism research group.

And so we all are teachers. Our father was a teacher. He's, um, predeceased. He passed away six years ago. He was a college professor, so. It's just been ingrained in us. Yeah. And I love seeing my students just light up when they could read a sentence or light up when they, you know, wanna discuss a book when I taught fifth grade or a historical thing.

Um, and, um, we used to do these funny air quotes when we'd talk about colonizers, who would discover. Like, how can you discover something when people were already there and my fifth graders would just be laughing, like, I know Mrs. Edmonds, where did they discover anything? You know? So we made it fun and we, and also I challenged them and, and that's to me is.

What I loved when I taught, um, my students, because they would always come back to me as grownups going, you made me think Mrs. E you made me like really question some stuff. And, and you also made me look at other perspectives. 'cause to be honest, I was the only licensed African-American teacher in my school district and we had over 2000 licensed teachers up here.

Yes, yes. And when I left, um, four years ago, it was really heartbreaking, you know, because a lot of my students, and it wasn't just my African American students, it was my white students and their families as well going, what?! You are going? And I said, yeah, I'm had my business. And I was going both, you know, working them both full-time and to devote to my family.

I decided to be a full-time entrepreneur in this education business and. It was hard. It was hard for them to say, you know, who is our representation? But it wasn't my job and my burden to carry, you know, it was the district to start hiring more diverse educators. And we have in Duluth, Minnesota, three accredited colleges right in our backyard that have really robust education programs.

So they were there, you know, but again, that psychological safety. Of these African American and student teachers of colour doing their, you know, their, um, experiences and their, their, their, um, their, uh, clinical, not clinical, but their hours of education hours, they're in your classrooms and if they don't feel psychologically safe, they're gonna go.

Down to Minneapolis to get their teaching, um, position. So it's a big thing to think about. Like it doesn't have to just be Jebeh in that classroom. There should be more of us to be representative. Mm-hmm. 

[00:45:52] Ellington Brown: So what are your, oh, let me rephrase that. What are some simple. But powerful actions that schools and organizations can take to become more inclusive?

[00:46:09] Jebeh Edmunds: Yeah. I call this the three Cs of cultural competency Check. Correct. Connect. So when you're checking things, looking at your roster, how do you pronounce the person's name? Jebeh. If you don't know, ask Right? Things like that. Checking in on families when it's something positive, not when it's something disciplinary or hard.

They'll back you up when it's something disciplinary or hard. If you made those check-ins for positive check-ins beforehand. Correct. When harm has been done. Correct your implicit bias. Think about the other person's lived experience and, and, um, identity. I'm not saying you have to be an expert in all, but you have to be an expert and know that other identities exist.

Correct that correct the harm, and then of course, connect. Go deeper than having your diverse posters go deeper than having your Black Lives Matter signs on your front lawn. Connect with people connect with your black neighbors, connect with your neighbors that are of different religion backgrounds than you are, versus just waving.

Get to know that person's name. Connect with them. So yeah, check, correct and connect. Those are three simple things that you can do to keep this movement forward. 

[00:47:36] Rita Burke: I like that Check, Correct, and Connect. I'll remember that because I don't always connect. I'm willing to check. Mm-hmm. But I don't always correct, so I I will try that now too, because we do have a implicit biases.

There's no question about that. Yeah. Now what if you had an opportunity. Ms. Jebeh Edmunds? Mm-hmm. To be the guest speaker for a class of graduating educators. What three nuggets, what three gems would you leave with them as you speak with them? 

[00:48:24] Jebeh Edmunds: Oh, yes. Wow. Okay. Here's my biggest thing, especially when I was a first year teacher, some nuggets is you're, you're gonna make a lot of mistakes and that's okay.

You're gonna make a lot of mistakes. Um, I would definitely say lean into those seasoned veteran teachers for advice. Definitely observe, um, those veteran teachers to see how they transition their students from one subject to the next. That's a lot of stuff you don't really get, um, in the classroom. In undergrad or in grad school.

Um, when I had my first year, I. Spent the, the dates we had no school. I drove down to Minneapolis and I observed my mom and I saw how she transitioned her first grade. We taught the same grade. So it was nice to kind of see how she would move her students in from one concept to the next. That was one big thing.

The next big thing too is um. Kind of not only you say fake it till you make it, but you have a lot of learning to do. Your first year, you're gonna have to teach yourself concepts In practice, you know you're gonna see you're teaching real human beings. So yeah, you think you got this wonderful lesson plan.

But you know what, Timmy? He's gonna be taking the sand full of his, you know, in his shoe, and he is gonna dump it on your carpet. What are you gonna do? Right? So you can't just expect everything is gonna go smoothly. You gotta figure out the tools of how you can keep going on a dime. You know, to help Timmy pick up that sand off of his shoe and still be reading that book with your students without missing a beat, it's gonna take time to get that.

And another thing too that I really wanna tell those new graduated teachers is when you've got a principal coming in. Lie, you know, to do your observation, I used to tell my students, the principal is watching them and, and observing their behavior. They were on their best PS and Qs. So when I would have an observation, my students were sitting up, they're looking at the principal and she's typing on the, on her laptop, and one little girl was like, am I gonna make it?

Am I good? And she's like, what did you tell them, Jebeh? I said that You are observing them. You're not observing me. So anytime the principal would come in, they would be sitting up tall, like, oh, she's coming to watch us. So I would say, yeah, lie, lie to the kids to say, when you got your, your observation say, yeah, the principal's gonna be watching your behavior.

So make sure you're really listening to my, my, my story today. And they go, oh, okay, Mrs. Edmonds not knowing. Not knowing. Yeah. That's the, that's the teacher hack. Yep. And they were always on their Ps and Qs when I had a, had an observation because they thought, oh, they're looking at me, they're not looking at Mrs.

Edmonds, they're, they're checking me if I'm a good listener. So, yeah. Yeah. So those are the kinds of things that I would definitely leave with those new teachers is learn from those seasoned, you know, seasoned veteran teachers. They've got lots of gems to help you along the way, observe your own work and, and know things are gonna go wrong and how to best prepare it.

And then yes. Yeah. Sometimes you gotta kinda flub a little bit to get those observations under your belt. So yeah. 

[00:52:00] Ellington Brown: I, I just have, I just have one more question. 

[00:52:03] Jebeh Edmunds: Sure. 

[00:52:04] Ellington Brown: And that, and that's about mentorship. 

[00:52:09] Jebeh Edmunds: Yes. 

[00:52:09] Ellington Brown: So everyone, for mental health reasons, we need to, we need to have mentors or a mentor.

[00:52:19] Jebeh Edmunds: Mm-hmm. 

[00:52:20] Ellington Brown: How did you go about selecting your mentor?

[00:52:26] Jebeh Edmunds: That's a really good question. I feel selecting my mentor to come that's above me to help me learn the way. Oh, definitely. My mother. I mean, I've been watching her my whole life teaching in the classroom, and so for me, getting her advice when she came up to visit my first grade classroom, I couldn't sleep.

I was like, wow. The ultimate observer, right? I was. So nervous. I'm like, the superintendent can come in my classroom. I was totally fine, but my mom, the best teacher I ever met and she said I did fine. And that's when I could, you know, how breathe, you know, like, oh, I did well. But, um, she was my mentor. She still is, you know, about life and raising children and yeah, just getting her advice has really kept me going throughout my years.

So yeah, she's my best mentor. For sure. Yeah. And for me to mentor other young women has also helped me as well. Um, there was a woman who adopted, um, three black children and was also a teacher, white American woman, and I'm still a mentor to her oldest daughter. You know, she came to me and said, I would love for you to mentor my child.

You are so inspiring and you, you really are working hard in this community. And she's got her masters of education too, and is a young mother. And just to see somebody from her high school days as a mom now has been amazing. So I love passing that and, and making, you know, putting that also back forward, you know, into.

Mentoring other young women. Yeah. Other, yeah. Young women of color. 

[00:54:12] Ellington Brown: Wow! All I can say is this has been a remarkable conversation with each other. I really come to know you. I think our audience has come to know you.. How in the world did you wind up where you are today? I mean, you are a, your cultural competency expert.

You have 18 years plus experience, uh, the host of your podcast. 

[00:54:48] Jebeh Edmunds: Yeah. 

[00:54:49] Ellington Brown: You share your practical, insights. On creating inclusive spaces and schools and workplaces and communities. We discussed a little bit about your heritage, your book which is Orange Blossom, which we've got an opportunity to listen to a snippet, earlier in this podcast. So I just wanna say thank you, thank you so much for everything. It has been wonderful. Rita, do you want to add something to that?

[00:55:21] Jebeh Edmunds: Thank you! 

[00:55:22] Rita Burke: Well, it, it's interesting that I ask or guess questions and sometimes I try to apply those questions to me. Particularly the question, what do you do to bring joy into your own life? And my response today would be talking to people, having these conversations and SpeakUP! International because there's no question that, or guests bringing a whole smorgasbord of experiences and wisdom and knowledge.

But most important, they bring joy. So I thank you. I thank you. I thank you for lighting up my life today by visiting with us and SpeakUP! International! 

[00:56:09] Jebeh Edmunds: Thank you so much! Oh, it's a pleasure. Oh, thank you. I loved our conversation this morning. Thank you all! 

[00:56:24] Ellington Brown: Thank you for listening to SpeakUP! International! If you wish to connect to our guest, Ms. Jebeh Edmunds, please be prepared to submit your name, your email address, and the reason why you wish to contact Ms. Jebeh Edmunds at www.jebehedmunds.com. Ms. Edmonds has other social media accounts you can use to connect to her, that will be listed in the description section on Spotify and other social media platforms. 

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