Debbie Nichols-Skerritt's Rhythmic Healing: Uniting Dance, Massage Therapy, and Community Wellness

Speaker 1: 0:04

Welcome to Speak Up. International with Rita Burt and Elton Brown.

Speaker 2: 0:10

No wonder this is called Speak Up International, because earlier today we spoke with a man from Virginia and we have spoken with people from Brazil, from Great Britain, from South Africa, and today we're back home at this point talking with a woman from Markham, Ontario. Her name is Debbie Nichols-Skerritt. Debbie is an educator, artist, speaker and mentor who embraces movement medicine as a point of connection with students and peers. Debbie is also a holistic practitioner who is the founder of For your Temple, which is a wellness company. In addition, she is the creatress of AfriqCore and makes use of movements from African Caribbean diaspora as a rehabilitative and healing modality. There's so much more that I can tell you about our guest today, but you'll hear it all. I guarantee you'll hear it all as she tells her story during our conversation To our listeners. Please help us. Welcome Debbie Nichols to Speak Up International. Welcome, debbie.

Speaker 3: 1:38

Thank you so much for having me. Thank you.

Speaker 1: 1:41

It is definitely a pleasure having you here with us this evening. What motivated you to establish For your Temple as a wellness company, and what unique offerings does it provide?

Speaker 3: 1:57

Wow, that's a great question. Again, thank you for having me. For your Temple actually believe it or not was birthed in about 2007. And it became. It was basically a fusion of all of my wellness experiences in my life thus far. So a bit of history about myself. I've been a registered massage therapist since 1999. And in conjunction with my massage therapy career, I was a professional dancer with one of Toronto's premier Black dance companies, coba Collective of Black Artists. So going through that process, I would always connect my wellness experience and rehabilitation through massage therapy and just understanding how that worked in my life. And, of course, you heard the term your body is a temple. So I just started to really be drawn to so many wellness modalities, started to really be drawn to so many wellness modalities and I was just like these are going to be services for your temple, right yeah, so that's where it came from initially.

Speaker 2: 3:13

So you are a massage therapist and then you kind of segued into the arts. Talk to us about that segued into the arts.

Speaker 3: 3:29

Talk to us about that. Well, like I said, my massage therapy career was in parallel with my dance training. I started dance training relatively late compared to the average person. I started in my 20s and so I was just walking in tandem with respect to this new experience as getting into like a pre-med program in massage therapy, because it's very deep in the anatomy and physiology and that sort of in kinesiology and all the pathologies, and then this new experience with respect to dance training, this new experience with respect to dance training.

Speaker 3: 4:06

But I saw, I saw the connection, even when, with my own body and the fact that I needed to go to dance rehearsal to escape, regardless of how difficult it was. And I found myself, unfortunately, if anybody had passed in my life, instead of staying, you know, I would go to, for example, the funeral, the celebration, and people like, oh, are you going to stay for the repass? I said no, I have to, I have to go to dance. I have to go to dance because that would be my release, that would be my way of just getting that energy out and really connecting the repertoire. Most of it was from an African, caribbean lens, african diasporic lens. It just became so nourishing to me in so many different ways. And then I would always see dance from that perspective, like, yes, it's entertaining, but it was so much more for me. And as I started to go on to be an artistic mentor or a dance mentor and choreograph and teach younger students, I would always emphasize the fact that, yes, dance is for entertainment, right, but especially our people and our lineage, we have to understand that we use dance for so much more. It was spiritual connection, it was a way to communicate. It was obviously a way to release intense, intense emotions, historically and even up to now as well, as dance can be a sign of protest and so many other things like just awakening in, like sensations in the body. So I wanted to really get out of the paradigm that, especially from a Western gaze, that we're not just dancing for entertainment and even though it's beautiful to dance for entertainment as I am still a performer and mentoring and teaching younger people to perform in this well, in this milieu but I wanted to make sure that we don't have this we're shucking and jiving from Massa only you have to understand what this is and it's a powerful modality way beyond, way beyond dance.

Speaker 3: 6:34

And on top of that, I, I, my, my family has always, even before I got into formal dance training, I came from a family that loved to dance. I'm a first generation Canadian and my family came from Barbados and growing up, I would always remember us going as children every weekend because my parents migrated, obviously, and everybody else, this community that was around the Caribbean community, it didn't matter where they were from. Every weekend there was a function at Auntie So-and-so's house. Auntie So-and-so's and the kids would be upstairs and the parents are downstairs dancing and you know they would pull you in, come, come, come, come, come. And I was just like this is such a beautiful experience and, dare I say, that's the reason why I find like even DJs in in my generation have such um richness because they came from that experience and so they know how to play and connect um to audiences in a different way.

Speaker 3: 7:36

There's a multi-generational type of experience. So I was like and this is nothing to do with stage, right, and so it was it. That was the way to communicate and and um being from an island like, for example, like Barbados, like many other islands, my dad would like dance with auntie so-and-so, my mom would dance with auntie, so-and-so. So you know that it's communication, but then when my parents came together, there was a difference in the essence, like you know how he would hold his arm to her chest and all these things that are so beautiful, that have nothing to do with performance, but it just is the beingness of that communication. So I really want to get that across as much as we. There's a discipline and dance that we are that we have to offer. Know that there's many layers and I want the students to know that this medicine comes from you first and then out to the audience, right, okay?

Speaker 1: 8:35

So you talk about dance and the importance of dance, and it's just not about dancing. It's a spiritual kind of a thing, it's therapeutic. And so how do you use the therapeutic way of communicating when you are giving your massage therapy?

Speaker 3: 8:59

Ah, so, interestingly enough, that's a great question. So, for example, if I was working with somebody who's having really intense back pain and what you know, of course it's great to have a massage, but sometimes we can relax too much that the back doesn't have the same type of support I would utilize and in this context I would say movement, because sometimes dance really tends to intimidate people. Right, because sometimes you're worried about the five, six, seven, eight. But just therapeutic movement is ultimately dance, ultimately a dance, an expression of movement, is dance. Right, I would, after the massage, I would take them through a series of movements to stabilize, for example, the pelvis and the spine, open up the hips so that when they come off the table they're like oh okay, I feel so much better, I feel longer, I don't feel crushing into my spine or I feel like I'm a lot more mobilized from sitting down for hours and hours and hours and hours and hours.

Speaker 3: 10:08

And I came to that awareness when I was taking I started to take Pilates certification. Of course, with the massage knowledge and the dance experience, I felt that I needed to go further for other rehabilitative purposes or ultimately just to help me after I had my son and once I great education but it was in a Eurocentric frame and I remember sitting down just taking notes feverishly. And then there was one instruction instructor that was speaking about the fact that the spine can move separately from the pelvis and it can move in so many directions. And I was looking around and so many of the students were like wow, really so many ranges of motion. And I'm saying to myself, as people of African descent, we could do that with our eyes closed.

Speaker 1: 10:57

Right.

Speaker 3: 10:58

And it was just like and they're saying this is rehabilitation and physiotherapists use this all the time and I was like our experience is a wellness modality, a rehabilitative modality. And then I started to really kind of fuse that, in my own type of expression, which became Afrocore, which I used on initially rehabilitating dancers, and it just started to kind of expand from there when I started to realize, especially when I work with women, like emotions start to unlock, right. But if I was working with a mixed group of men and you see the warriors in them come out and their back is moving and the shifting starts to happen in the atmosphere and in their body, and I was like this is so powerful and of course, why? Why historically, do we have, you know, dances on the continent for special occasions and that sort of thing, or even in in the Caribbean Caribbean, of course, we have all these traditional dances from these lands and they're powerful. But they were so much more meaningful than entertaining for Mesa, right, it was for us.

Speaker 2: 12:18

So that's how all of this came about. I saw, debbie, some pieces being lived out that you choreographed, and when I approached you, I said to you that I saw more than entertainment. I saw history, I saw culture, I saw pride, I saw dancers connecting in a spiritual way with their audience and I was really, really impressed because, in my simple mind, dance was for entertainment. In my simple mind, dance was for entertainment, but I was able to move beyond that based on what I saw your group doing, and realize that it serves a wider purpose. I was very, very impressed. Thank you so much. Now tell me about your mentoring. Talk to our listeners about your mentoring.

Speaker 3: 13:15

Mentoring. Talk to our listeners about your mentoring, wonderful. So mentoring as a choreographer, like, for example, what you saw with who I affectionately call my dance daughters, firstly, so I've been teaching at Dole Academy, which is the name of the group that you saw, do-o-a-h-l, which stands for dance on a higher level. So I've been there. Basically the concept bloom where you're planted, right so in the, in the Markham community, and I've been there really to, yes, choreograph and bring the Afro African diasporic dance forms into the program for a number of years. But also in mentoring them with respect to empowerment. So it's huge to ensure that our students are embodied with pride, and that's what you, I think that's what you were experiencing, rita, just the embodiment of pride, because we will do things like mentoring, as, even as a health care practitioner in a choreographic space, mentoring these girls, like, for example, if they start their menstrual cycles, we, you know they would come to the door after a while. After a while, Miss Debbie, so-and-so, just came out and I was like, bring them in the room, you know, and put on the music and start dancing and everything, and understanding that the movement of the hips has initially always been like a therapeutic expression and a celebration of fertility. So mentorship in that regard, especially for young girls to be empowered, is really really huge.

Speaker 3: 14:55

I do a lot, I do quite a bit of mentoring in the Toronto District School Board as well, through, like, through the arts department, and just I'm starting a new venture with respect to mentoring, with respect to sacred sensuality, and all of that is just embodiment work anyways, right. So understanding that, and when I use the term sensuality, it's just like really being able to be present and enjoy what you see, enjoy what you feel, enjoy what you taste, enjoy what you hear, even if it's going to like a restaurant, right, but using the movements and the embodiment to really come out of your head and drop into your body and really start to experience a life on in a magnetic level, right? So those are the spaces of mentorship that um is happening in the present moment. You know how do you?

Speaker 1: 15:51

introduce your daughters to this sacred sensuality, transformational, and how do you get them to relax and accept?

Speaker 3: 16:03

That's a great question and ultimately, when I'm working with younger people technically use the word sensuality because it could be, you know, triggering or alarming for the parents, but every single day that they're in class with me, we always start with a warmup and and the warmup is literally going through the body and I would tell them, like you know, ultimately, yes, you're going through the body to warm up your instrument, to tell stories, but also let them know, especially when we get into the hips. This is what, this is what you need to do, especially when you're feeling cramps around that time of the month and that sort of thing. So it's like a holistic introduction and it's normalized, so they're automatically embodied day after day, month after month, because of the fact that they're doing a routine or what you would call ritual of warming up right, as opposed to their head is somewhere else and their body's doing something else. It's just really bringing them into connection and awareness right, and in that we normalize a lot of the conversations around just their development. We don't demonize them or we don't use like yes to us, this is a reason why it's just more than a dance. These are my daughters, so, whatever, I would uh want to have come to a platform that would be comfortable for my son. I create that same with with my daughter, of course.

Speaker 3: 17:27

The director of the dance company, um uh, charlene hines. We're of the. We vibrate in the same way, so this is very much up her alley. So there's a lot of support around that. So every day and they see us modeling it, they see us embodied, like you know, even if we're getting costumes ready for competition, we make a big deal.

Speaker 3: 17:51

Turn around, let me see you. You know very Caribbean-esque, right, and very, very African-esque, and they said, yes, turn around, oh, yes, and we celebrate the curves and that sort of thing. And really, really, I need to see you move your hips, because that is where the rhythm is, not for not to entice anybody else, but that you're a musical instrument, right. And once we, when we start to dance like this and leave the pelvis and the spine out, as a little girl, as I told you, I would watch my parents communicate and my aunties and uncles communicate that way, and it wasn't sexual for me, it was always rhythmic. I was like this is a beautiful way of communicating. So that's what I offer to my dance daughters and it's normalized, it's modeled, it's embodied, it's celebrated.

Speaker 2: 18:43

So I'm hearing, then, that it evokes joy, and joy for the dancer and, more than likely, joy for the adults that are working with these young people.

Speaker 1: 18:57

Absolutely, that's what.

Speaker 2: 18:57

I'm hearing coming from you, absolutely. You know we have a book huddle children's book huddle and we meet on the second and fourth Thursday of every month online and we talk about children's books and one of the books that I presented to the group not long ago it's called my Mommy Medicine. It's written by Edwidge Dandekat. You may have read some of her works because she's a prolific and excellent Haitian background author. I saw this book and the title. I became curious what is that about my Mommy Medicine?

Speaker 2: 19:41

And as I read the title in your bio that says movement medicine. I'm thinking. I've never seen the word medicine used in this kind of a way before, but I like what I see, I like what I hear, I like what it evokes. Talk about movement medicine for us, please.

Speaker 3: 20:03

So that's wonderful. Thank you, I really want to explore that book. So, movement medicine, movement, ultimately, again, I see it as a healing modality. Yes, it is an artistic expression, but, as I mentioned before, our artistic expression or our cultural expression is in itself a healing modality, and I utilize movement not only to ease aches and pains, but it is to get you through whatever is, whatever condition is happening. So once we start to realize when we move our body, circulation starts to stimulate. Of course our lymphatic system starts to stimulate. So, of course, for those of us that might not know what our lymphatic system is, it's basically like the sewage system of the body. It takes away all the you know, all the impurities of the body, which is connected to the circulatory system, and then we would be able to excrete it out through passing water, right, releasing of endorphins, right. So now we're talking about the central nervous system and what I find which is really effective, as like an artist, educator, is usually when students are having an issue with concentrating or retaining information, get them up and start moving. Put on some music, get them up to start moving, and then whatever they need to retain, they'll retain On a personal, a very personal level.

Speaker 3: 21:36

My, for example. My father bless him. He's 98 years old, he's going to be actually 98 in August and he, of course, with my mom, has, over the years, have modeled how much movement is so important to us in their lives. And now he's still a mobile. He's still very mobile, especially in the summers. We're always out gallivanting with him at this festival and this festival and it's the movement that keeps him going right. It's the movement that keeps my mom going. So whenever there's been a stint that you know somebody is not feeling well which is very rare I would always ensure that I'm reflecting back to them what they reflected to me. Put on the music, let's get to moving, and then things start to shift. You see, the stiffness and the achiness goes away.

Speaker 3: 22:31

Whatever the case may be I'd mentioned this before as well with respect to um, um, just, either, menstrual cramps but even when women are giving birth, like what is it that we have to do to bring that baby down? If, in fact, they're able to come down outside of a cesarean birth, right, they have to move their body. It is medicine, you know, um. And even in the artistic space. So even if you are in a performing space, once you've awakened to the fact that this is medicine. I am not now just. I'm not only just a dancer doing the choreographer's work. I'm experiencing the medicine for myself. And now I add a different layer on stage, and that's again what I really try to impart to my dance students, my dance daughters as well.

Speaker 3: 23:22

So the way movement activates every single system in your body, it's a healing modality. It's no different than going to get prescription to change something. But because of the fact that many of us in society see it so separate, it's either dance and the medical field is over here. But once you start to embrace the holistic reality of what movement can do for you right, if you're at a computer eight hours a day, if you're sitting down, if you're sitting down because you're driving in traffic all the time and we get up sometimes we're stiff you put on some music and start getting your spine into it and your hips into it and all of a sudden you're like, oh, oh, I feel so much better. And then and your mood shifts to the serotonin all these things start to start to really start to circulate.

Speaker 2: 24:16

And you're like oh, I'm in a different place now. This is beautiful. I wish our listeners could see what you're doing here.

Speaker 1: 24:21

Maybe we'll use part of that as the introduction.

Speaker 3: 24:25

Wonderful, absolutely.

Speaker 1: 24:27

Can you tell us what is artistic education?

Speaker 3: 24:32

Okay. Education, okay. So an artist educator is somebody that goes into the schools and either brings core curriculum so, for example, math, and for example, my lens would be movement or dance. So I would bring, for example, a geometry lesson into life, right? So we're looking at shapes like the slides, the rotations, the reflections, right? All that is dance choreography.

Speaker 3: 25:03

So instead of just being on a grid paper, we personify all of this and bring it to life. So the students are just having a full-on experiential or integrative experience when it comes to their learning, especially students that are kinesthetic and, dare I say, most of us are kinesthetic learners, meaning that we learn through doing, as opposed to just kind of sitting down. But any other art form, whether it be spoken word, infusing that, for example, with language, or there's so many ways that we can pull the arts in to have an educational experience. So when you hear somebody saying they're an artist educator, they're usually going either into the schools or into different agencies or even in the corporate space and shifting up the atmosphere of the everyday and bringing information or a learning experience to more of an integrated artistic expression.

Speaker 2: 26:06

So I believe I believe that I'm hearing that dance is more than dance. I believe that I'm hearing that dance could be used for a variety of subjects, to discuss a variety of subjects, and it could be enjoyed by the dancer and, ultimately, by the people that are watching. I like that, I like that I really really like that you know, bringing community together and you know right. Yes.

Speaker 3: 26:50

Bringing community together in a multi-generational way Wonderful.

Speaker 2: 26:54

Very interactive, right, wonderful, and it's all part of our story, part of our history, part of our culture, where we didn't see the lines between generations like we do in Western societies.

Speaker 3: 27:11

Right, right, exactly, exactly.

Speaker 2: 27:16

So, we're speaking with Debbie, who is a dancer, who is an educator, who is a mentor, who fuses dance with healing, and, on Speak Up International, we seek to inform, to educate and to inspire and, based on what I'm hearing, you're helping us to meet those goals. Now, debbie, was there ever a time when you had to say enough With?

Speaker 3: 27:52

respect to dance Anything. Enough With respect to dance Anything. You know what I'm going to say, as I'm going to many, many times. You know life has their ups and downs, but the most recent experience of me saying enough Was, I would say, eight weeks ago.

Speaker 3: 28:13

Um, and what I meant by that is, you know, this message that comes through me with respect to movement, medicine and all these things that, um, I believe that you know, spirit has gifted me with, um, I was, I wasn't, I really felt with, I feel within myself that there's there's more that I'm supposed to do, but, quite frankly, having the skill set to kind of get my message out there and market and whatever.

Speaker 3: 28:45

So I heard in my spirit, you know, go in a sabbatical for eight weeks, and I'm anybody that knows me and the people that I love very much, I'm always like, hey, how are you doing, and everything.

Speaker 3: 28:55

And I'm the first person to offer help in that sort of thing, and what spirit is telling me is the fact that you will help them. But if you go into sabbatical and be quiet, the power and projection of you going forward is going to not only impact you but impact everybody else. So, with my dearest friends, I've been in a sabbatical. Projection of you going forward is going to not only impact you but impact everybody else. So with my dearest friends I've been in a sabbatical. So I would say enough, but not enough out of a space of frustration, but it's like enough and all that energy I just needed to pour back into me so I can go forward and cultivate and learn and expand, so that when I do come out it's just like okay, I'm able to support community in a more powerful way, as opposed to just loading. So I would say that that's my most recent account and I'm really enjoying the journey you are dancing, you are moving.

Speaker 1: 29:52

Every joint in your body has expanded, they're all loose. There's this magical expression you and your dancers are creating enormous amount of energy. Yes, thank you. Who is that energy going to? Is it arbitrarily just going to the individuals that are enjoying the show, or is it reserved in some kind of way? Can you talk to us about that?

Speaker 3: 30:21

That's a great question, I think. You know. I would say it's multifaceted and, like I said, I usually not usually I really emphasize the fact for my dance daughters that they need to fill up themselves first. So the dance needs to feel, has to resonate with them first, as I have to do for myself. So once that fills up, once they fill up, and then it's like a connection from the most high, the creator, God, whoever they feel that is. So it's like a two-way thing here and then it spills out to everybody else, right. So I just realized I was just moving my hands again, so, and sometimes it goes, and then it goes out in different places.

Speaker 3: 31:17

So, for example, I was a liturgical dancer many years ago, right, and I would obviously just being in the connection and hearing, hearing in praise and worship experiences. You would hear the musicians and the singers, and I'm feeling things and hearing things in my spirit, and sometimes I would hear go and turn in front of this person, Right, and then I don't know, but I'm doing it, and then all of a sudden that person starts to break out and cry, and then you know we'll come back and say to me you know, whatever you're doing, like I was dealing with this illness and whatever, and it's just whatever you're doing, like I was dealing with this illness and whatever, and it's just whatever you're doing was breaking up and I was like it's not me, it's just you know. So there's so many different directions, but once we start to move just like prayer, meditation because movement for me is a prayer, dance is a prayer, right, it's no different Just like how some people singing is their prayer, yeah. So once I get into that atmosphere, once we, you know we cultivate that atmosphere for our dance students or participants that are in workshops that you know I would facilitate Once they experience it, they themselves can hear all these things that you know, that I'm hearing, or my dance daughters are hearing, or whatever the case may be.

Speaker 3: 32:42

So it's not just reserved for those of us that have been training all the time, it's for everyone, every single one, Once they're open enough to embody it. It couldn't just be this, you know, and just a little instruction, and then tapping into oh, I'm really starting to hear it getting visions and ideas, and you know. So it's really a powerful atmosphere to cultivate when you're willing to go all in.

Speaker 2: 33:11

You're making dance sound like a liberating tool and it frees people up, and I like what I'm feeling. You also talked about dance taking a sabbatical respite for Debbie. Talk to us more about how you maintain your well-being well, movement, of course, dance and move.

Speaker 3: 33:40

Um, I'm really big into breath work. Um, I am as well as a breath master. I would love to say that I get massages as much as I'm a massage therapist, but I'm just telling you a lie. But what? But I do like I've got one colleague and a dear friend of mine that when we can catch each other we will do that.

Speaker 3: 34:02

But ultimately, submerging or immersing myself in an artistic space and moving as much as possible, that's the most important thing. Obviously, we're here now. Being in nature is big. The weather is not 100% warm, but even in the pandemic there was a group of us that would go walking in the wintertime and it was just being in nature is so powerful and and so what I even before that, what I would do, even with my Afrocore classes, was have Afrocore classes outdoors.

Speaker 3: 34:40

So just connecting all these things and it's the way you feel afterwards, you know the energy of the sun, the ground sometimes we're by water and the movement and the breath and the connection, it's just like it's so magnetic. So those are the things that I hold on to to really kind of make myself grounded, and, of course, prayer and meditation, but often, oftentimes, you know, I go through cycles. I don't know about anyone else, but oftentimes I go through cycles where I'm in a space that I just can't sit and pray. But if I move and, you know, get into my space, then I'm like, oh, I could sit and pray. Now you know what I mean. So it's a massive tool for me.

Speaker 1: 35:25

You talk about breathing. That caught my attention. Are we talking meditation? And if so, are you able to meditate during this breathing exercise along with the dance?

Speaker 3: 35:41

Yeah. So that's a great question. I love these questions, thank you. So I've been trained as a breath master after becoming a dancer. That was probably in the last, uh, four years. So, um, what breath? So breath work can be for meditation.

Speaker 3: 36:01

But what, and um, I, most dancers you would most mature dancers or seasoned dancers would would be able to be aware of connecting movement and breath.

Speaker 3: 36:14

So when we're right, so and that is number one to really color the movement in a different way, but also to to to release energy within your own body, right. So it's really important that sometimes I'm in stillness because I'm just getting out of bed and it will become more of a mindfulness and or meditative type of work, right, depending on the technique. But then other times I layer it with if my Afrocore classes or other times I would layer it just in other workshops where I just need people to move and they may feel a bit anxious about something or a memory or thought would come up. That is pretty uncomfortable and so we just kind of get. I would get them to move and then just facilitate them in some breath work, just so that energy starts to dissipate through their body, right. So again, that is a powerful tool and breath and movement or movement in breath you would. You would see that very much synonymously in my world breath and movement.

Speaker 2: 37:27

So you said you started dancing to you late in your 20s. Yes, Formalized training.

Speaker 3: 37:36

Yes.

Speaker 2: 37:36

Formalized training? Yes, so is it too late for us?

Speaker 3: 37:42

Absolutely not. And I and I and I'm not even saying that Like absolutely not, when I think, because of my relationship with my family and the elders in my family, I think I get the most amount of joy when I see elders getting up and moving, because you, you know it, you see the change in their face. Um, and you, you've been in, I know, you've been in spaces when you see it, and sometimes it's just music and stuff. But if somebody just kind of gives permission because society literally, I'm even feeling it too, almost like it just caters to the youth and after a certain age you're just like, you're not, it's society or modern day culture wants to say that what's the insinuate? That you're not as valid. But when we tap into our cultural expression, we know that it's multi-generational and it's like come, auntie, come, come, granddad, come, come, come, and all to dance. And next thing, you know, it's like you know, and then all of a sudden it's this kind of breaking free and you know they're just like I get like this, you know, and they're talking with their bodies. It is, it's the most, it's the most magical thing for me. It's the most magical thing for me.

Speaker 3: 39:05

And when we're looking even at experiences of dementia. Experiences of dementia, movement and music helps a lot of individuals come back to that place that we're familiar with, right, because, like the limbic system, all these parts of the brain start to light up again. This is the medicine, again, right, and it's really beautiful to be in that state and to watch your loved ones or people in your community just come back to. Even if it's really beautiful to be in that state and to watch your loved ones or people in your community, just come back, even if it's for a moment. And we really need to cultivate spaces to consistently support that. Just the relationship that I have and seeing my parents age beautifully and utilizing dance as a tool, a medicinal tool for that.

Speaker 1: 39:58

It sounds a lot like spirituality in a way, because you seem to lean towards the energy, and it appears to me that this energy is limitless once it's beginning to go, as you put it, go through your body. Is there a way that you can use this energy, say? I know some people that are spiritualists. They are into different forms of massage therapy where they're able to use this limitless energy in order to heal individuals. Do you find using dance, breathing and all the other methods that you've talked about so far this evening, they aid you or put you in a position to provide such limitless energy power?

Speaker 3: 40:50

100%, 100%. And I would start by saying creative energy is spiritual energy. When we think of the creator and we talk about creative arts, for example, dance, to me that's one and the same, right. And so once we're able to cultivate an atmosphere of movement and it's not only coming from me as an individual, and now it's like a two-way street, and now we're communicating but we're seeing people opening up emotionally, that sort of thing there's an atmosphere now that you can pay attention to. And the same goes in holistic wellness spaces.

Speaker 3: 41:41

The same goes that every cell vibrates in the body. So once we are creating an atmosphere where we're nourishing ourselves and we're shifting the atmosphere because maybe we might have been a little bit serious and now we're starting to move and dance and play, and now there's a vibration of joy. Now you're able to cultivate that and move that energy through your body. Right, it takes time, it won't happen probably in one encounter, but the more you stay connected to that practice or that habit, whatever you want to call it, it does elicit the healing power. And basically it's just that infinite energy is transferring through you, just like how you would hear powerful singers, vocalists that transcend through song. It is the exact same way through movement that can facilitate, like sound healing, movement, healing exactly that.

Speaker 2: 42:56

Do you know that we often talk about standing on the shoulders of others in our community and we pause to pay homage to those people? Is there somebody whose shoulder you believe?

Speaker 3: 43:15

you're standing on 100%. There are many those that are with us right now my parents, godfrey and Jasmine Nichols they're just tremendous and you know, my aunts and uncles that I've passed on. There's so many people that are in my family or in my community that have supported me. But before I got formalized training, that came where? Who are my dance mentors that came from? Who came from the professional dance company where I was trained, right and so? Bakari Lindsay and Charmaine Headley those are my dance parents, and just to.

Speaker 3: 44:15

I could go on and on and on. But you know, that is where the impact initially came from, the innate grooming of me as a little child. But then, when I walked into this space, I realized that I was home and I realized that everything was just, you know, just. I was like, oh, this is so wonderful and I just soaked in everything like a sponge and being able to pass that on to the next generation, so for sure. But I mean, I could go on and on and on. My brother, my brothers actually, um, I'm the only girl and the baby and my brothers have really opened my mind to musical experiences, um, way outside of what I would expect, and I pull that with me too. So, yeah, I'm totally blessed and just humbled by the experiences and the community that I have, and I want to offer that to everybody else. I think everybody else should have such a powerful and influential community as I did, so that's why I try to create communities of the same energy.

Speaker 1: 45:32

I think, in your own way you are doing that through dance and the creation of this healing energy that allows people that are actually dancing and those that are in proximity. Everyone gets the opportunity to heal on different levels. Sometimes you don't know the problems that someone may have. It may be emotional, it could be physical, whatever, but because of the fact that the dance is pure, it's able to travel far and wide and reach these individuals that need you the most. I want to thank you so much. We've talked about a lot of stuff your movement medicine, the sacred sensuality, transformational part of your tribunal and you also talked about your culture, social and spiritual experiences.

Speaker 1: 46:33

You're doing so much for your daughters, your dance parents, even for us, who have the opportunity to listen to what's going on in your life, and it's also helping individuals, our audience, to be able to understand yet another facet of Black excellence. Yes, these are the things that we are looking for in Speak Up International, and I thank you so much for spending the time with us this evening.

Speaker 3: 47:09

Thank you so much for having me. I really enjoyed this. Thank you much for having me. I really enjoyed this, thank you.

Speaker 2: 47:13

I echo what Elton has said and I'll tell you two phrases that will linger with me after our conversation. The first one is dancing is not about chucking and jiving for massa.

Speaker 2: 47:29

I'll never forget that. It's a term that my daughter likes to use the chucking and jiving massa. I'll never forget that it's a term that my daughter likes to use, the chucking and jiving, and sometimes we do that. And dance is prayer, powerful statements that will keep on resonating with me and I wish you well in your journey as a healer, as a medicine person, using dance as your modality.

Speaker 3: 47:51

Thank you. Thank you so much. It was an honor to meet you and thank you for inviting me here, mr Elton, thank you so much. I really enjoyed our conversation.

Speaker 1: 48:00

Our pleasure. Thank you for listening to Speak of Exclamation Point International. If you wish to contact Ms Debbie Nicholas-Serect, please be prepared to submit your name, your email address and the reason why you wish to contact Ms Nicholas-Serect to info at speakuppodcastca. Are you interested in the opportunity to be interviewed and have your cause promoted by Speak Up International? We invite you to connect to us by sending a message that includes your name, company or organization name, the valuable service you offer to your community, and your email address to info at speakuppodcastca. Worried about your confidence as an interviewee? Don't fret.

Speaker 1: 48:57

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